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When Kelsier destroys the Pits of Hathsin in Final Empire, it is mentioned that they'll take something like 300 years to start producing atium again. Do the Pits of Hathsin still exist in any form after Sazed reshaped the world, and is that timeline for them still valid?
RAFO.
You've said you want to write a book set in the Southern Continent. I did enjoy the Emperor's Soul a lot, so I am curious about you writing that future book. How do they use magic differently, and why should we be excited about reading a book set there?
The southern continent is where people have discovered how to harness the metallurgic arts in a more mechanical method. (I've hinted several places that this is possible. I've been holding off doing it until we go here.)
About the southern continent, would it be possible for other Scadrians to discover this method of using the Metallic Arts, or is it unique to the southern Scadrians?
It is technology-based rather than genetics based.
In Mistborn there's no flowers or anything. So how do they get dyes for their dresses and things?
It depends on the dye. Some come from animals like snails. Some are metallic. Or, metallic is the wrong term. From minerals like lapis and things like that. There are a lot of non-floral dyes out there, even in our world. And they had extra resources in that.
In Bands of Mourning, there are a bunch of runes that they press in to open the door in the temple. Are these an actual writing system or did the Sovereign just do a bunch of doodles?
I didn't intend them to be doodles.
If the Olympic Games existed in the Mistborn universe, what would some of the events be? This is assuming, of course, that magic is allowed and isn't seen as a form of cheating.
I'm fully expecting to find out in Era 3. Will be very disappointed if sports are never mentioned.
I already started laying the groundwork, if you look in the Era 2 books.
Does Wayne have a first or last name?
In Mistborn, last names are in flux. A lot of people still don't have them, as they weren't a skaa thing. However, Wayne would have one he could use, if he wanted.
Chapter Seventeen
The Mists Form
In writing this book, I had to nail down a few worldbuilding issues I'd been contemplating even before the first trilogy ended. What would happen to the mists, for instance, once Sazed took over and became Harmony?
The mists, obviously, are a big part of the series. It didn't make sense—either narratively or worldbuilding-wise—to lose them completely. However, they'd been created as an effect of Preservation trying to use his essence to fight against Ruin's destruction of the world. So . . . wouldn't they go away?
I decided that Sazed would still send them. They're part of the nature of the world now. To acknowledge what had happened, they wouldn't come every night any longer. But they would come. They were changed in that they are no longer simply the raw power of Preservation; they're now a part of Harmony—so they no longer pull away from Hemalurgy in the same way as they used to. They still have the odd effect of being able to power Allomancy. (And Feruchemy as well—if one knows how to do it.)
The mists are, in part, the raw power of creation. And when one is favored of Harmony, the mists have a greater effect than they might otherwise have. We'll see more of this later.
What's the closest that humans had gotten to the 'inhabitable' zone of the planet during the events of the first Mistborn trilogy?
There were groups who would go out there to escape the Lord Ruler, and the Final Empire in general. Survival was practically impossible. It's possible someone might have gotten across to the southern continent, but it would take a small miracle.
In Secret History, Hoid says something to Kelsier about him destroying the Pits and destroying an entire mercantile system. Is he talking about literal inter-Realmic trade?
Yes. Interplanetary trade, yes.
Follow-up: Is House Venture involved?
House Venture is not involved. People in House Venture might be.
The guy who--
Here is a RAFO card for your follow-up. House Venture is-- Yes.
Why don't Northern Lights ever appear in the Era One Mistborn trilogy? If Luthadel is situated at the Magnetic North Pole?
It has-- ‘Cause as I understand--has to do with-- what is it coming off the sun--
Solar flares?
That cause the aurora borealis. It's not just the magnetic-- There's physics involved which are not relevant in the Mistborn world.
How does Harmony know about radio?
There are actually two answers to this. First, Harmony was given a grand understanding of the laws of the universe during his Ascension. Second, Preservation had some limited precognitive abilities. Either one of those can lead you to the answer.
What happened to the Ministries?
The Ministries, being a legacy of the time of the Lord Ruler's rule, there are trappings of them left but they don't use any of the same names or anything like that.
Can't have the old labeling.
Yeah. I mean-- There are cities you can go to where there are more echoes of that sort of thing.
Yeah because New Seran made me think of that.
Yeah. I mean there are cities you can go that have more echoes of that but in Elendel you can barely even find the trappings anymore-- but you can find some of them. But You won't go in there and find, like, the Ministry of this-or-that. Because it was run by Kelsier's crew, most of that did not make the transition. Though there were notable Obligators who made it through and so they have left their mark. You have to search for it though.
So here's my last question. If there ARE people on the other side of the world, did Vin kill them all by placing the sun on their side, or do they have they're own Ruin/Preservation battle going on over there as well? Do they also have allomancy feruchemy and hemalurgy?
No, they're not dead. Yes, Rashek was aware of them. In fact, he placed them there as a reserve. I knew he wanted a 'control' group of people in case his changes to genetics ended with the race being in serious trouble. All I'll say is that he found a way other than changing them genetically to help them survive in the world he created. And since they were created by Ruin and Preservation, they have the seeds of the Three Metallic Arts in them—though without anyone among them having burned Lerasium, Allomancers would have been very rare in their population and full Mistborn unheard of.
The people in the Central Dominance speak a sort of French accent. Is that still the case in the Wax&Wayne era?
It has mostly changed. I mean there are still some French regions, but there are some Germanic regions also and things. It is no longer just the same positioning, it's more kind of, well, like your family heritage and things like that.
Do Scadrians have a piece of Harmony?
Yup.
We're moving in the story, timewise, much more quickly here than we were at the beginning of the book. Often there will be a week or so between chapters. It's kind of hard to tell in my books, as I don't talk very often about time passing. That's not one of my things; my books tend to feel very compressed, as if they happen over the course of a few days. However, each of the Mistborn books has covered many months—the first one covered almost an entire year. The nature of the Final Empire, where it tends to have very mild winters, makes the changing of seasons rough to follow.
Did Trell ever have any pre-[Ascension of the Lord Ruler] Terris worshipers?
Yes
Are there any racist jokes in the Mistborn world?
Yes, I would think there are lots of racist jokes everywhere. It's more of a thing on Roshar, however, where the races are more distinct and rub each other the wrong way more often.
Is there more to the Roshar world than what is shown on the map or is it just that?
There is only one continent. Now if you are paying attention, that's not answering your question completely.
It's just different realms and all that. I meant like more landmass.
There is only one continent on Roshar.
Just different versions of it.
That doesn't mean there aren't islands out there.
Now the Mistborn world there is a whole lot more.
We've only had that one little part so far.
Yeah, but it's basically almost all empty because... Which is actually very fun for the worldbuilding, is this idea of a mostly unpopulated world.
The round map [in Mistborn: The Final Empire] makes it look like it takes place over a hemisphere...is that intentional?
Yes, actually. Though, when we put a map in the book, we'd probably fuzz the edges so we don't have to deal with that. However, after what the Lord Ruler did to the world to try and stop the Deepness, the only habitable parts on the planet are the poles.
In Shadows of Self a few characters use some variation of "Hell!" as an exclamation when things go awry. I don't recall any reference to "Hell" as a place or philosophy in the religions of the Mistborn series. How does this word fit into their world, does it differ from our own?
The characters in Mistborn have been using "biblical" curses since book one. This was a specific choice made on my part, as I want the "feel" of Mistborn to be like London in the early 1800s. All of my books are to be read as if there's a phantom translator who took it from the original language and translated it into English. In many cases, there isn't a word that is an exact translation—so the translator does their best.
In The Final Empire, there was indeed a kind of "hell." Though there wasn't a specific idea of a devil—it was just the punishment ascribed to the souls who failed or disobeyed the Lord Ruler. Even the skaa knew of this, though religion was forbidden them. So it was a more vague sense, than specific theology, to them.
Why did Hoid in Secret History have to ride on another person to get to the Well, when that person could float on--
Sooo, what he's floating on is a Cognitive Shadow. It's a spirit, it's not an actual person. He is floating on someone who is--
Do we know them?
You did not know them, don't worry about them. But see, he's using that as a boat because it's easy to sink through the mist. And if you notice, he has to coat his oar with Investiture in order to move him. So yeah, he's floating on a person's soul... It was so much easier with the Pits, but that's because there were boats and things.
What would have happened if Kelsier hasn't taken Preservation or later Sazed hasn't taken Ruin and Preservation powers? Would the earth have been destroyed due to so much raw power much before the actual destruction due to Ruin's actions?
Yes. Bad things would have happened.
Like Sel?
Not going to answer that. Just bad things would have happened.
Are any of your books' locations (barring Legion) based on real-life places? If so, where? If not, what propels your creative drive to make new worlds?
All of the keeps in the Mistborn series are based on real structures I've visited. The mists are based on a trip to Idaho, were I drove through a fog bank at high speeds.
Warbreaker's setting was inspired, in part, by a visit to Hawaii.
Much of Roshar is inspired by tidal pools and coral reefs.
I asked him about what the board refers to as "reverse" compounding - i.e., using Feruchemy to enhance Allomancy, rather than the other way around. I wanted to make sure that it was really a thing that exists.
He said that it was.
Is this what the Southern Scadrians have been doing?
It's similar, but not exactly the same.
Will there be a book about the Southern Pole of the Mistborn world?
That's a RAFO. By the end of the Era 2--Alloy of Law Era--you will know more about them.
What's up at the south end of the world (during the 'closer to the sun' phase)? Life there? Cultures? Allomancers? Assuming that there is some life down there, can we assume that we'll have some interesting 'culture clashes' in future books?
They will be known by the modern trilogy, so it's safe to assume that a discovery will happen soon. Either during the Alloy of Law era or soon after.
Ketchup does not exist in the Final Empire, since it is from a fruit, which are flowering plants. The Lord Ruler did not engineer fruit. Mostly people eat vegetables and roots.
(As a side note to this side note, the planet this is all taking place on is barren and virtually uninhabitable save for the poles, a situation caused by the proximity to the sun. [Editor's note: More on this in a much later annotation.] The Final Empire is at the north pole. What's at the south pole? Hum. I wonder. . . .)
In Mistborn Elend carried dueling canes.
Yes.
And I didn't understand why people would be scared of sticks. So is a dueling cane a deadly weapon, a melee weapon, *inaudible*
Yes, they use dueling canes in martial arts on Earth, so you can look up-- look for these. They are sticks about <two feet?> long, made of a hardwood, and, I promise you, if hit with one of those, it's going to hurt. So yeah, I mean you can go find my references for various types of dueling canes in various martial arts. They are real things. But we needed a weapon that was not metal and that was the best one, I felt.
One thing about the sex scenes (or hints of) between Vin and Elend that strikes me, and those I've discussed it with, as odd is that there seem to be no contraceptive in the Final Empire. That'd be the most logical conclusion, seeing as skaa raped by Noblemen needs to be killed, there seem to be no other way to handle it. But that means that, to our understanding of the character, Vin wouldn't have sex unless she actively wanted to get pregnant. She's all too paranoid in general to just leave a thing like that to chance it, even despite loving Elend. How does it work?
There are indeed contraceptives, but noblemen tend to not trust them. After all, they can be executed for making a mistake.
You have said the Scadrians on the southern continent does have interaction with the Metallic Arts, but use them in very different ways. Does this mean there are different, for example, Allomantic abilities for those Scadrians? Or is it more a cultural thing?
The abilities are the same. The way they harness and use them, though, is different...
Someone on the forum I'm on wanted me to ask you about citrus fruits during Vin's time.
Citrus fruits during Vin's time because of the lack of flowers, and things like that? Their fruits were not our fruits. Let's say that.
Were they close to, like, Rosharan, like bulb fruit?
Yeah, there were definitely some bulb fruits. But any actual citruses, I don't think that there were.
The [Scadrian] calendars don't appear in Arcanum Unbounded, but they're mentioned on the map as old calendar/new calendar. Since the Lord Ruler actually kept the calendar the same, what this is referring to is only the placement of seasons, since those have to change from year to year because of the orbit.
The Mistborn Era Three is going to be set in like present day. Are there going to be like Coinshots doing ear piercings and like carpenter work and y'know...
You'll just have to see.
Did the Dadradah religion originate on Nalthis?
It's influenced by Nalthian ideas, but I wouldn't say it originated there. But there is a connection there.
Is it known to most people in Elandel that Ranette has a girlfriend? Or are they hiding?
They don't need to hide in particular in Elendel.
You always come up with new ideas for books, when you have so many to write as is, that you've recently started to go from saying things like, "Whenever I get to this book," like the Threnody novel, to, "If I ever get to it." Would you ever let another author write for Cosmere?
That is possible. Isaac [Stewart], my art director and long friend for, you know, fifteen years, who's been collaborating on the visual style of Mistborn, really wants to write a Mistborn novel set on one of the Southern Continent places off by itself and I'm intrigued by this idea, 'cause he's somebody I've worked with for so long. So we might see how that happens. So far I haven't been willing to collaborate on any Cosmere stuff, but it's p-- I could see it happening.
Can you use Hemalurgy to power machinery?
He was initially confused as to what I meant, so I said I got the idea from thinking about FTL travel, and he said that it was a RAFO, but that I was thinking along the right lines, there needs to be a merger between magic and technology.
How are the main characters like with regards to homosexuality? I imagine the likes of Sazed wouldn't care, but it'd be interesting to see how much of a deviant the characters we've come to know are, when compared to their world's societies.
Again, you're going to see a wide variety of attitudes and impressions here. Some are very deviant from society, while others are good expressions of it.
One thing I do downplay in the books is how often characters are terribly biased. Basically all the protagonists in the Stormlight books are, for example, HORRIBLE racists. I bring it up now and then to make sure the text, at least, knows this fact--but it's also something that, if I did with a dose more realism, would be very offputting. So I try to walk a line where it's an ugly thing that rears its head now and then, but it is still possible to like the characters, acknowledging they are products of a very different society from our own.
Views on homosexuality are the same. You'll see, for instance, that Sigzil has a problem with Drehy in Bridge Four. Similarly, some characters have more progressive views than their society, as I think would be realistic for the types of people they are. So you don't see as much from the text as there might otherwise be. Ranette's relationship is not quite as accepted in Scadrian society as Wax and Marasi's viewpoints would lead you to believe, for example.
So, the Synod in Elendel in Era 2. How much political control or guidance do they have over the other Terris enclaves? Do they have some sort of central government that makes decision for everyone? Or are they all--
Excellent question. No... I would say... let's see if I can find a real-world example. I'm not sure off the top of my head. I'm gonna say, they do not have any official control. They are well-regarded and respected, and sometimes ignored. And different groups regard this differently, the authority that they have. They would claim to have more than they do, how about that.
How was Sazed/Harmony able to communicate with Waxillium near the end of the book? During the original trilogy, Ruin could occasionally implant thoughts into people's minds, but he couldn't just listen in whenever he felt like it. Is Harmony just way more powerful?
There is interesting discussion about this one below, which I like to see. I thought this might spark some discussion. Remember that human beings were given more of Preservation than Ruin during their creation, which led to Preservation eventually being overwhelmed by Ruin. That was the bargain; people would be of Preservation at their core, but in turn Ruin got to claim the world once Preservation wound down.
Another factor to consider here is that Wax was given a special earring designed for communication with a being that he actually worships.
Where does the fiber for fabric come from on Scadrial?
[Brandon misunderstands the question to be about Rosharan fabrics] Some of it comes from seasilk. The silk is not the same silk that we [have], most of it is from plant-based textiles. Most of the-- here we have insects, we can use their cocoons and stuff; cocoons on Roshar have rock in them. And so it's a little bit hard. But a lot of the plants do too, and there are a lot of plant-based textiles you can use, so...
Didn't you ask about Scadrial?
Oh, Scadrial! I was thinking about Roshar. Yeah, Scadrial is an Earth analogue. Scadrial is my place that if it's on Earth, you can assume it's on Scadrial. That is not the case for the other worlds, but it is for Scadrial.
Who names the planets? You've said once that "Scadrial" was the name of the planet as Ruin and Preservation knew it, but where'd they get that name? Do the Shardholders all get together and vote on it or something?
He said thay already had their names and that the all the planets existed before the shardholders got there.
Are there Surges that could be considered as God Surges, like the God metals on Scadrial?
Yes.
Progression and Adhesion, perhaps?
No, but they could be considered as such.
So, I was thinking how the third trilogy was mentioned as being in the future (as opposed to the second trilogy being contemporary to our time), and I wondered if the people from Scadrial would be able to visit the other shardworlds without using Shadesmar - and, if so, how would they do it?
The simplest (and most boring, and not germane to the topic) method would be FTL travel.
But then I got to thinking about Pulsers and Sliders.
My first thought was, "Hey, what if a bunch of Pulsers - or some Pulser-inspired technology - could put a bubble around the crew quarters of a starship? That would allow the crew to travel from one system to another within their own lifetimes." Just put the ship on autopilot, power up the Pulser Engine, and go have a sandwich.
Then I tried to figure out if something similar might work for Sliders, but the first bump I hit was that bendalloy bubbles - and cadmium bubbles - were stationary. Which, in turn, would probably rule out the Pulser starship.
But then I thought some more. These books take place in a universe which is, astronomically, pretty much like our own. It follows the same rules of physics. Which means that Scadrial is rotating on its axis, while it revolves around its star, while that star moves within its galaxy, and that galaxy moves within its universe.
Which means, technically, bendalloy and cadmium bubbles aren't stationary. They're stationary relative to one object - Scadrial - but they're perfectly mobile when one looks at the bigger picture.
This makes me think that a Pulser starship might be possible, provided the Pulsing can be anchored to the ship rather than Scadrial.
It also makes me wonder why the default anchor is the planet and why nobody has figured out how to anchor it elsewhere. Is it simply a mental block that could be overcome? Is a person too small to be used as an anchor (even though the bubbles pop up with the person at the center)? Can a bubble's size be altered, dependent upon the size of its anchor? (That is, could a small bubble be made around, say, a person's heart if the whole person were the anchor?)
I still dig the idea of Allomancers Iiiin Spaaaaace!, though I'm not entirely sure how it would work.
[Links out to WoBs about Metallic Arts FTL being a thing]
So FTL is confirmed
There's an issue with conservation of momentum with speed bubbles.
We know Elantris and all the other worlds have their own calendars. What does Scadrial's calendar look like, especially relative to Earth?
For those who don't know, the Mistborn world was designed as my earth analogue. Meaning, if you go look at Scadrial and say, "Does this creature exist on Scadrial?" It probably doesn't exist on Roshar, and it's a toss-up if it exists on Sel, the Elantris world. But on Scadrial, if I haven't said otherwise, you can guess that it does exist. And that's why the cultures and the languages and the linguistics, I just built that one to kind of be the familiar place. And that's because... so, you would say, like, seven-day week. Basically seven-day week, like our calendar-ish.
Roshar's, by the way, is pretty bizarre. Roshar is five-day week, set into fifty-day months, which there are ten months in the year, with a double-year cycle of highstorms. So, it's a thousand-day cycle with two years in between those. It's this really bizarre thing we came up with, but Roshar's supposed to have bizarre stuff.
If Odium were lured to Scadrial, would his physical body turn into a burnable metal?
If so, could Harmony create an Odium-metal legion of Mistings to consume and burn it?
Would that weaken him sufficiently enough to be killed or destroyed?
The difficulty here is, again, one of Identity. People born on Scadrial have an Identity tied to it and its magic. Odium would have to do certain things to make them able to use a magic he fuels. He has done these things on Roshar, so it's not impossible for him to manage it on Scadrial.
Did Kelsier leave Scadrial when he went to the Ire fortress?
I consider him not having left, but being very close to leaving. He couldn't have actually gotten off-planet with the way that he existed at that point. So, no, he did not leave Scadrial. At least the sphere of influence of Scadrial.
Hi guys, this might bore some (most) of you but this is my take on why the plants on Scadrial were turned brown after the Lord Ruler's Ascension.
So basically, heres a bit of plant biology:
Plants absorb light during the first phase of photosynthesis , converting specific waves lengths into high energy electrons, which are then used to create NADPH, ATP and Oxygen. Some of these molecules are then used in the second phase to make carbon molecules, which we break down into energy.
However, only specific light waves are used by plants, namely the red, blue, purple and to a lesser degree yellow waves. The green light waves are not absorbed and are actually reflected - the reason why chloroplasts and plant cells containing chloroplasts are in our eyes, green.
Because of the ash in the sky, plants were not able to get enough light, and thus were unable to survive. To combat this, the Lord Ruler altered many plants to have a new pigment (say chlorophyll-C) which allowed them to absorb green light waves and therefore get more energy - stopping them from dying.
Thus, green light was no longer reflected by plants and they were brown instead (probably because light absorption isn't 100% effective and so the small resulting meld of colours looked brown to the people of Scadrial - like how paint eventually just turns brown when you mix too many different colours).
Although this makes sense to me, I'm sure I've overlooked something, and I'm not sure why this would result in plants that were less nutritious to man kind. Maybe because of the ash? I'm pretty sure that at some point Sazed mentions that the plants help breakdown the ash so maybe this made them less nutritious?
But yeah, there you go, the science behind the brown plants on Scadrial!
This is actually pretty close to correct. The plats are not actually "sickly" or unhealthy. I basically looked at plants like red sea weed and some ornamental plants and asked about how they got energy--and came to many of the same conclusions that /u/neverbeenspotted has come to.
Seems like a smart worldhopper could hybridize pre-final empire plants, final-empire plants, and post-final empire plants in various ratios, and be able to market crops adapted to a very wide range of environments. Anything like that going on?
Things like this are more "Space era cosmere" than it is current era.
